Lord of the Dreadfort. (Or Lady?)

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Lord of the Dreadfort. (Or Lady?)

PostPosted by champion0 » Thu Jul 28, 2016 21:45

Ok, so I am a HUGE book fan, also an avid show fan! Yay me. I have a question to pose for the TV show, because I really don't know the answer.
Roose Bolton is dead (should never have happened but alas!) and then Ramsay himself died.
Who inherits the Dreadfort? The second most powerful holding in the North, will thousands of men still loyal to the Boltons...
According to book logic there are two possible scenarios now that the Bolton lineage has ended:
1) Sansa Stark (or Sansa Bolton) was married to the last Bolton. According to book logic certainly she, as the most closely related to the last landholder, should inherit the land.
2) The land should revert to the king.
Just to reiterate, the Dreadfort is hardly a minor holding. Is the show even going to address this point? If Sansa finds herself a wandering courtier again... she is now a hugely powerful individual in the North regardless of whether Jon is made the King in the North.
And just to rub it in further, LEGALLY she would become the Lord Paramount of the North under the Iron Throne too! Unless Cersei decides (as she would) to strip the title from her, blaming her for Joffrey's death... but how would Cersei even act against her? Sansa's only possible rival for lordship of the North would be Jon. Littlefinger could act to prop Sansa up as the Lady of the North in that regard...
I don't know. Do we think the show will even address that issue next season?
Cheers all.
My Bolton AAR, on the Paradox forum:
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/in ... ar.960162/
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Re: Lord of the Dreadfort. (Or Lady?)

PostPosted by EDAP » Thu Jul 28, 2016 21:58

champion0 wrote:I don't know. Do we think the show will even address that issue next season?
Cheers all.

The show does not go into the minutiae of succession details the way the books do. At best there will be a throw-away line such as "Lord so and so, go demand the surrender of the garrison, and take the lands for my sister", most likely the issue will be dropped. The question is important, but the show has less time than the books and more important issues to deal with.
Here is a link to my personal list of FAQs. Please check there to see if it answers you question. The specific details aren't up to date, and I probably won't update it for a while, but the general ideas are unchanged.
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Re: Lord of the Dreadfort. (Or Lady?)

PostPosted by LancelotLoire » Sat Jul 30, 2016 23:49

Legally she wouldn't become the Lord Paramount. The Stark family had already been stripped of the title, and she herself was wanted for "killing Joffrey". The lord paramouncy would immediately fall to the throne to be granted out again.

As for Sansa inheriting the Dreadfort, I could see that she might actually want to take holding of it. Just to completely remove anyones memory of Ramsay or house Bolton. I could see her going and "tearing down" and memory of House Bolton.
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Re: Lord of the Dreadfort. (Or Lady?)

PostPosted by Azsouth » Sun Jul 31, 2016 01:20

idk if that is what show Sansa would do but I'm pretty sure book Sansa knows the history between House Bolton and Stark and would definitely tear down the Dreadfort like Ned did the Tower of Joy just to finally get rid of anything that had to do w/ flaying. Show Sansa would probably take the keep, replace all the banners w/ Stark ones and merge the levies w/ the vale army to try and usurp Jon at this point lol.
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Re: Lord of the Dreadfort. (Or Lady?)

PostPosted by suvantar » Mon Aug 01, 2016 19:06

Assuming there are no more Boltons in direct succession, (which is a reasonable assumption given that prior to Fat Walda's baby, Roose was desperate enough to engage in the relatively unusual act of legitimizing a grown bastard with little knowledge or training, who he noted had behaved in a personally embarrassing manner to him more than once), ie no brothers, no living fathers, uncles, etc, it would then fall to any cadet branches of the Boltons. They would look for any cousins, distant or otherwise who still held the Bolton name. Then assuming, there are no cadet Boltons, you would run into a stickier situation because you would started looking at Bolton women of the past would have married into other households and who would have been their heirs. It's all in the game. That's one of the ways that suddenly you thought a holding that was firmly in the hands of your dynasty suddenly falls into possession of another House. But no, Sansa doesn't have any claim to the Dreadfort simply because she was married to Ramsay, any more than she has a claim to any Lannister holdings by virtue of being married to Tyrion. The notion of the spouse inheriting anything is pretty much a modern conceit. Primogeniture laws will pretty much look to maintaining the family legacy over everything else.

The title of Lord or Lady Paramount would fall to the king or queen on the iron throne to bestow. Sansa would not really have any claim to it, because the last legitimate holder of the title was Roose Bolton, not Ramsay Bolton. I am pretty sure that, at the very least, once Ramsay married Sansa, who is regarded as a criminal wanted for regicide, Tommen's advisors would have told him to consider Ramsay Bolton to be in rebellion, so it is highly doubtful that the title of Lord Paramount of the North fell to him. He might have been regarded as King of the North if enough bannerman rose if and when the crown came to arrest him, because that title is not dependent on the sufferance of monarch on the iron throne like Lord Paramount, the but I don't think he ever claimed either of the two titles, just Winterfell.
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