What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by Andre Massena » Tue Aug 29, 2017 16:09

StoneWallace17 wrote:
blackninja9939 wrote:
DominusNovus wrote:What about using the Chinese Emperor system for the White Walkers/Others? They're off-map and uninvolved for most of the story, but their influence is felt, and, eventually, they start marching on the realms of men.

And what interactions would you have with them to gain their good graces and spend that on? They are an undead horde they hardly care about giving you stuff :D

Sacrifice your children so they spare you? :lol:


Blowing a certain horn and sacrificing your entire fleet with priests and your pregnant paramour tied to the prows?
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by Borderline5 » Tue Aug 29, 2017 18:22

it would be good with the new DLC that the devs of AGOT mod would be able to look at valyria and make it playable like before the doom
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by blackninja9939 » Tue Aug 29, 2017 19:05

Borderline5 wrote:it would be good with the new DLC that the devs of AGOT mod would be able to look at valyria and make it playable like before the doom

No as we still have the islands of Valyria on the map. And they are shattered and would need to have the map changed dynamically in the history which is not possible.
The off map system will not change anything about Valyria being ruined or not.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by Mirith » Tue Aug 29, 2017 20:22

Truth is... there probably isn't any "hidden", off-map empire or faction worth including.
Sure, sure. Cannibals or Winged men are out there... non-existent in most cases, buuuuuut no information was released about them. Or other very important empires/groups

This mod has done great job in recreating complete map of the world.


Valyria, you say?
Aaaaaaand... what would do? Let's say, you theoretically have feature to contact Valyria.
What would be the point? There's no bookmark with Valyrian empire in full strength.
What we have are just ruins.

And to recreate scenario before doom, you'll need far, far, far more information and separate mod... much like with Century of Blood.

There's actually one mod out there, during Andal invasion. But it isnt fully fleshed out.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by sidious307 » Wed Aug 30, 2017 00:41

He can serv for white walkers and great waste creatures ?

also, some fa eastern cities are off map and maybe the uknown continnt from sunset sea ?
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by Soulbourne » Wed Aug 30, 2017 04:02

I'd like to bring back the fact that for a suggestion to be included there needs to be a decent canon reason for those groups to have a large enough diplomatic effect alongside general info about them rather than fan theories or vague rumors told in a single children's story so far. While they may stretch some things to make it work, there at least needs to be a basis for the guesswork to build on.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by DominusNovus » Thu Aug 31, 2017 05:38

blackninja9939 wrote:
DominusNovus wrote:What about using the Chinese Emperor system for the White Walkers/Others? They're off-map and uninvolved for most of the story, but their influence is felt, and, eventually, they start marching on the realms of men.

And what interactions would you have with them to gain their good graces and spend that on? They are an undead horde they hardly care about giving you stuff :D


Well, I'm assuming there will be enough mod-ability with the new feature to give different types of interactions. Rather than seeing the Others on the map, the Emperor window would show you what the status of the Others are ('nobody's heard from them in millennia', 'a local wildling has been sacrificing his sons to some ancient gods 'rumors among the wildlings of strange events' 'rangers are going missing' 'the nights watch swears the dead are marching' 'seriously, guys, the wall is under attack by ice spiders') instead of, say, the economic status of China (famine, plague, stable, golden age).

Your interactions would be possibly sacrificing children if you're a wildling, sending rangers if you're the NW or warriors if you're a wildling, but not much else for everyone else, until the Others are really on the march.

It would probably be best to consider it a way to represent how much society is aware of the actions of the Great Other, and have the armies of Others be equivalent to the Western Protectorate in JE.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by sidious307 » Thu Aug 31, 2017 06:04

soubd wonderful, perhaps it weill be added. does another area this feature could be apply ?
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by blackninja9939 » Thu Aug 31, 2017 07:55

DominusNovus wrote:
blackninja9939 wrote:
DominusNovus wrote:What about using the Chinese Emperor system for the White Walkers/Others? They're off-map and uninvolved for most of the story, but their influence is felt, and, eventually, they start marching on the realms of men.

And what interactions would you have with them to gain their good graces and spend that on? They are an undead horde they hardly care about giving you stuff :D


Well, I'm assuming there will be enough mod-ability with the new feature to give different types of interactions. Rather than seeing the Others on the map, the Emperor window would show you what the status of the Others are ('nobody's heard from them in millennia', 'a local wildling has been sacrificing his sons to some ancient gods 'rumors among the wildlings of strange events' 'rangers are going missing' 'the nights watch swears the dead are marching' 'seriously, guys, the wall is under attack by ice spiders') instead of, say, the economic status of China (famine, plague, stable, golden age).

Your interactions would be possibly sacrificing children if you're a wildling, sending rangers if you're the NW or warriors if you're a wildling, but not much else for everyone else, until the Others are really on the march.

It would probably be best to consider it a way to represent how much society is aware of the actions of the Great Other, and have the armies of Others be equivalent to the Western Protectorate in JE.

So what your saying is there would be basically no interaction at all and you would have only one way to gain grace and no rewards except for not getting attacked?
Yeah no the current system already does that fine, no need to make it an off map system for something that gets no actual bonuses from it especially on the grounds most people do not even believe in the Others let alone would be constantly checking up on them...
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by imp » Thu Aug 31, 2017 16:48

How about Common Folk as offmap faction?
So you would need to actually do something to ensure people like you; it would replace the event spawned troops like ‘Faction Revolt - Great numbers of Rebels flock to your banner’ and ‘Faction Revolt - Rebels flock to rebel leader's banner’.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by blackninja9939 » Thu Aug 31, 2017 17:23

imp wrote:How about Common Folk as offmap faction?
So you would need to actually do something to ensure people like you; it would replace the event spawned troops like ‘Faction Revolt - Great numbers of Rebels flock to your banner’ and ‘Faction Revolt - Rebels flock to rebel leader's banner’.

The common folk are not one united entity though... they are thousands of individual people of which are not united under one single ruler...
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by imp » Thu Aug 31, 2017 19:52

Sure, there is no ruler. I meant an abstraction of common-folk of your realm.
If the system demands a ruler for an entity, perhaps it could be just like a ruin, nobody nowhere.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by Lord_Verkos » Tue Sep 05, 2017 20:27

I wonder what counties will be silk trade post available with Jade Dragon, I assume Qohor, Norvos, Pentos, Volantis, Mantarys, Mereen, Essaria, Saath, Sarnath, Sathar, Qarth, Hesh, Vaes Dothrak, Yinishar, Bayasbhad, Samyriana, Kayakayanaya, Trader Town, Tiqui, Piqui, Linqi, Xin, I am not sure what others would.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by reg » Thu Sep 07, 2017 20:02

What about the Three eye raven / Children of the Forest gaining grace with blood sacrifice, giving a greenseer relative so it can be the next 3 aye raven, increasing the size of you godswood. They could grant a prophesy (reveal any plot), grant a greenseer courtier, give you greensight with learning education, grant you an animal companion, give you draglonglass item, even send you one of their own (like they do with the wildlings) with intrigue inclination. You´d need to be an old god follower (maybe preference with free folk and crannogmen)Their range of diplomacy would be the godswood with their weirwood net, so it´d be beyond the wall, the north except for the Manderlys -Whitehills and the Blackwoods in the Riverlands.

The Others would require blood sacrifice of your sons or a portion of your health, become tributary, maybe the burning of the godswood. In exchange it can grant you small to large regiments of light infantry (wights), an Other-Bride/Husband with great traits and of course they can´t attack you. These should only be available for wildlings with very specific traits and count level lords that are in a invasion war with the others, they to need very specific event like craven, selfish, ruthless and negative piety.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by ReallyCoolHat » Fri Sep 08, 2017 13:04

Why not make Asshai China for the Jade Dragon, I mean there really isn't much to do with Asshai now anyway and don't they trade with the world so that would work wouldn't it?
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by Exakter » Fri Sep 08, 2017 23:35

Now this is just me, but perhaps you could use this "off map entity" to help simulate the Walkers better? In some cases its FAR too easy to defeat them early on.

It could also be used to redo Beyond the Wall in general. I've never quite been comfortable playing with them or against them because as the wildings it can be ridiculously easy to defeat the Seven Kingdoms - basically just wait until they are at war and when you fight against them its too easy to defeat them unless you are dropped right in the middle of the conflict against Mance (the only time I've actively found them a challenge because the game scenario sets them up that way).

I realize this could be some work (both in terms of events and maybe retooling the map for the wildings at least), but just throwing out suggestions to prompt a creative discussion.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by BillNyetheRussianSpy » Sat Sep 09, 2017 21:19

It could be used for the White Walkers and the two Winter factions are the "Protectorates" and it could be used to show which season is coming and you could also submit to them and send "sacrifices" (like Craster) instead of eunuchs(convert to Cold Gods religion). The leader of the "outside faction" could be the Great Other himself
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by Damocles » Sat Sep 09, 2017 21:26

Exakter wrote:Now this is just me, but perhaps you could use this "off map entity" to help simulate the Walkers better? In some cases its FAR too easy to defeat them early on.

It could also be used to redo Beyond the Wall in general. I've never quite been comfortable playing with them or against them because as the wildings it can be ridiculously easy to defeat the Seven Kingdoms - basically just wait until they are at war and when you fight against them its too easy to defeat them unless you are dropped right in the middle of the conflict against Mance (the only time I've actively found them a challenge because the game scenario sets them up that way).

I realize this could be some work (both in terms of events and maybe retooling the map for the wildings at least), but just throwing out suggestions to prompt a creative discussion.


Wildlings basically need to be revamped to where instead of using an invasion CB on each other, they have to do various event chains (like the reaving one, culminating in duels) to defeat other leaders, and then gain them as tributaries. That way, it would take someone exceptional to make themselves King, instead of just buying a few mercs and spamming the invasion CB...
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by Exakter » Mon Sep 11, 2017 20:27

I have ideas of what I'd do with the Wildings but I'm not sure what options the DLC will actually give.

I.E. There is a HUGE difference between whether or not the Jade Empire options will be permanently visible, or could be enabled after a trigger. An idea someone had earlier on dealt with Walkers, and Black thought it was rather unnecessary to complicate things. I definitely see where he is coming from, but not having the Walkers around... but potentially being able to influence their arrival through actions (or inactions) could prove interesting and fun from a story perspective if the options in the files are varied enough.

To be honest I rather doubt the DLC will come with complexity to pull off most of these ideas (given that the main CK2 developers are working on different projects). I don't know if the modders have any advanced knowledge but if not... its a wait and see proposition.
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Re: What will Jade Dragon mean for this mod

PostPosted by blackninja9939 » Mon Sep 11, 2017 20:50

Exakter wrote:I have ideas of what I'd do with the Wildings but I'm not sure what options the DLC will actually give.

I.E. There is a HUGE difference between whether or not the Jade Empire options will be permanently visible, or could be enabled after a trigger. An idea someone had earlier on dealt with Walkers, and Black thought it was rather unnecessary to complicate things. I definitely see where he is coming from, but not having the Walkers around... but potentially being able to influence their arrival through actions (or inactions) could prove interesting and fun from a story perspective if the options in the files are varied enough.

The system is extremely moddable, you can hide things away.

Exakter wrote:To be honest I rather doubt the DLC will come with complexity to pull off most of these ideas (given that the main CK2 developers are working on different projects). I don't know if the modders have any advanced knowledge but if not... its a wait and see proposition.

Where you getting that idea from about the main devs of CK2 not working on CK2?
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