Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

Browse, publish and discuss user made sub-mods here

Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by ICU812 » Sat Sep 16, 2017 19:56

I might find myself in a minority, but I like the coin flip for the Targaryans. It helps give the dynasty some personality, and maintains it across a whole game. But why should the other Great Houses(and some of the smaller ones :)) be left out of it?

My idea is to branch out and make coinflips for all major dynasties and some of the smaller ones as well. These coinflips will give these characters a variety of flags and traits that can keep affecting them even into later life(i.e., don't make it easy for a Stark to lose their honor).

Now, I'm not asking for anyone to do this for me. This is a submod I'll be working on in my own time. I am, however, asking for ideas as I go through the process. I'm fairly new to event modding, but I've been modding characters, histories and save files for years. My main intentions with this submod, at this point, are:

1. Have self-contained event files for the coin flips of the major dynasties in GoT. Ideally, these will not fiddle with any other file besides 00_scripted_triggers and birth_events.

2. Have these coin flips be lore friendly. No Genius coin flips for the Starks :lol: .

3. Design it, from the get-go, to work with Congenital Overhaul by LancelotLoire. I can't see getting some of these flips to go without the expanded trait options this submod provides.

4. Not have the coin flips overpower any one dynasty or make playing as a non-coin-flip dynasty too much harder.

5. Have the event files work in a template fashion so their logic is easy to follow(much like the current coin flip events, thank you original mod devs).

ideas so far(not set in stone. Open to suggestions):
Starks: Pretty much this. Seems like a good starting point http://citadel.prophpbb.com/post106475.html#p106475
Tullys: High chance for Family Person.
Arryns: Chance of infertility?
Lannisters: Greedy/charitable coin flip, chance for ruthless. Maybe a chance for quick/genius.
Gardeners: Fertility. Lots and lots of fertility.
Tyrells: Attractive and fertile?
Baratheons: Strength, with personality traits such as wroth(Robert), diligent(Stannis) or gregarious(Renly)
Martells: Patient and proud?
Greyjoys: Lustful and greedy, probably. Proud, too. Lots of vices. I'm open to some positive attributes, here.
Mormonts: Chance for strong/tall and a high chance for bravery. Chance for poor_warrior from birth?
Tarlys: Strong(or at least brawny), with VERY high chance for bravery.

Feel free to tell me I'm being too ambitious too. I'm curious to see if I can get all of this done.
Last edited by ICU812 on Sun Sep 17, 2017 23:53, edited 1 time in total.
ICU812
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon May 25, 2015 05:33

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by Widowmaker94 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 21:38

All the Great Houses should have a chance for quick IMO.

Also, would this Great House Coin Flip work for the cadet dynasties as well?

If so, count me on board. I'll help you whatever way I can.
User avatar
Widowmaker94
 
Posts: 401
Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2015 18:57

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by ICU812 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 23:51

Widowmaker94 wrote:Also, would this Great House Coin Flip work for the cadet dynasties as well?



That's the idea. The Starks, for instance, have the following code in 00_scripted_triggers.txt:

Code: Select all
is_stark_coin_flip_dynasty_trigger {
   custom_tooltip = {
      text = is_stark_coin_flip_dynasty_trigger
      hidden_tooltip = {
         OR = {
            dynasty = 59 #Stark
            dynasty = 89 #Karstark
            dynasty = 63859 #Greystark
            #Stark Cadets
            dynasty = 45000200 #Whitewolf
            dynasty = 45000201 #Goldfang
            dynasty = 45000202 #Dreadwolf
            dynasty = 45000203 #Winterhold
            #Karstark Cadets
            dynasty = 45000364 #Karlsby
            dynasty = 45000365 #Burnwood
            dynasty = 45000366 #Greycliff
         }
      }
   }
}


I figured I'd include the Karstarks because, hey, they're a cadet dynasty already.

Widowmaker94 wrote:If so, count me on board. I'll help you whatever way I can.


Feel free to PM me. Or just share some ideas in this thread. Either way helps.
ICU812
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon May 25, 2015 05:33

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by Exakter » Mon Sep 18, 2017 01:18

I'm just not sure this makes sense?

For the Targs I always took the coin flip as to be because of their inbreeding.

Why would the Starks or any great house get such events?

If you want flavor events there are plenty I could think of to give them more flavor.

i.e. For the starks more events regarding the nightswatch, direwolves, beyond the wall, being honorable, etc.

i.e. for the greyjoys more events regarding their reaving.

i.e. for the tyrells more events regarding their family motto (growing strong) and family style events (the Tyrells more than any other great house really work as a family) and also their navy

i.e. for the lannister's more events regarding their dwindling gold mines, brightroar, and focus on vengeance and their unbridled ambition

i.e. for Martell, more events regarding their secretive nature, long-term planning, dornish/rhoyne culture

i.e. for Arryn more events regarding the mountain clans, etc..

i.e. for the Baratheons, more events regarding their ancestral ties to the Targs, their desire for combat, and their almost blind aggression.

This... is of course a lot more complicated than mere coin flips, but... if what you really what is flavor, surely these are a better long-term focus?

Otherwise, what will the coin flips be?

Greyjoy - ruthless/wroth/idiotic traits?

I just don't see it working in a way that enhances varied playthroughs.
Exakter
 
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 04:15

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by Widowmaker94 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 01:57

ICU812 wrote:
Widowmaker94 wrote:Also, would this Great House Coin Flip work for the cadet dynasties as well?



That's the idea. The Starks, for instance, have the following code in 00_scripted_triggers.txt:

Code: Select all
is_stark_coin_flip_dynasty_trigger {
   custom_tooltip = {
      text = is_stark_coin_flip_dynasty_trigger
      hidden_tooltip = {
         OR = {
            dynasty = 59 #Stark
            dynasty = 89 #Karstark
            dynasty = 63859 #Greystark
            #Stark Cadets
            dynasty = 45000200 #Whitewolf
            dynasty = 45000201 #Goldfang
            dynasty = 45000202 #Dreadwolf
            dynasty = 45000203 #Winterhold
            #Karstark Cadets
            dynasty = 45000364 #Karlsby
            dynasty = 45000365 #Burnwood
            dynasty = 45000366 #Greycliff
         }
      }
   }
}


I figured I'd include the Karstarks because, hey, they're a cadet dynasty already.

Widowmaker94 wrote:If so, count me on board. I'll help you whatever way I can.


Feel free to PM me. Or just share some ideas in this thread. Either way helps.



Cool. Well, as I said before. Having Quick as a possible (But rare) coin flip trait would be good for any Great House.
User avatar
Widowmaker94
 
Posts: 401
Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2015 18:57

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by ICU812 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 02:11

Exakter wrote:I'm just not sure this makes sense?

For the Targs I always took the coin flip as to be because of their inbreeding.

Why would the Starks or any great house get such events?


Their inbreeding had a hand in it, sure. But there are plenty of other families who blended into the bloodline(Houses Velaryon, Dayne, Martell, Blackwood and Arryn are all ancestors of every known Targaryen by the time of the books). Inbreeding is not the only reason the Targaryens are exceptional.

To me, the coin flip is a recognition of the fact that House Targaryen is an exceptional House with distinct traits that define its members. The thing is, Hosue Targaryen isn't alone in this. Baratheons are known for their strength and temper. Gardeners are known for their fertility. But after a few generations in-game, you'll find that the Targaryens still have their personality, but the Baratheons/Gardeners/etc do not.

Exakter wrote:
If you want flavor events there are plenty I could think of to give them more flavor.

i.e. For the starks more events regarding the nightswatch, direwolves, beyond the wall, being honorable, etc.

i.e. for the greyjoys more events regarding their reaving.

i.e. for the tyrells more events regarding their family motto (growing strong) and family style events (the Tyrells more than any other great house really work as a family) and also their navy

i.e. for the lannister's more events regarding their dwindling gold mines, brightroar, and focus on vengeance and their unbridled ambition

i.e. for Martell, more events regarding their secretive nature, long-term planning, dornish/rhoyne culture

i.e. for Arryn more events regarding the mountain clans, etc..

i.e. for the Baratheons, more events regarding their ancestral ties to the Targs, their desire for combat, and their almost blind aggression.

This... is of course a lot more complicated than mere coin flips,



Correct. Also, it pretty much only affects the particular house when you are playing them. But if you are not, House Stark, for instance, won't look anything like what the established universe says they were for literally thousands of years. That, as a fan of the world of ice and fire, is a little jarring. That is what I hope to correct a little bit with this submod.

Exakter wrote:... if what you really what is flavor, surely these are a better long-term focus?


If I only cared about the houses that I'm playing, sure. But I don't.

Exakter wrote:Otherwise, what will the coin flips be?

Greyjoy - ruthless/wroth/idiotic traits?



Pretty much. Feel free to read my OP. I did a pretty big list.

Exakter wrote:I just don't see it working in a way that enhances varied playthroughs.


Not for you, perhaps. I, however, will enjoy it thoroughly.
ICU812
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon May 25, 2015 05:33

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by Dingo » Mon Sep 18, 2017 05:36

I love this idea, although the traits in houses do change over time. Here im thinking of how weak the Lannisters were before tywin brought them back to glory. I would give them a good chance for selfish and ruthless and a small chance for diligent and quick.

minor niggles aside I think this submod would be great for gameplay and differentiating the houses.

my suggestion is Royce - flup for high chance of proud, maybe small chance of being birnna poor fighter, and a small chance to be dull.
Dingo
 
Posts: 80
Joined: Fri May 11, 2012 19:10

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by Exakter » Mon Sep 18, 2017 22:10

The problem is as the last guy said... traits changed over time.

The only reason Targ traits stuck around was because they FOCUSED on inbreeding.

NONE of the other great houses did to any degree where it showed any effect. But its your submod.
Exakter
 
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 04:15

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by ICU812 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 03:43

Exakter wrote:The problem is as the last guy said... traits changed over time.

The only reason Targ traits stuck around was because they FOCUSED on inbreeding.

NONE of the other great houses did to any degree where it showed any effect. But its your submod.


The Seed is Strong....
ICU812
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon May 25, 2015 05:33

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by Widowmaker94 » Wed Sep 20, 2017 06:41

Dingo wrote:I love this idea, although the traits in houses do change over time. Here im thinking of how weak the Lannisters were before tywin brought them back to glory. I would give them a good chance for selfish and ruthless and a small chance for diligent and quick.

minor niggles aside I think this submod would be great for gameplay and differentiating the houses.

my suggestion is Royce - flup for high chance of proud, maybe small chance of being birnna poor fighter, and a small chance to be dull.

Eh... Tytos SPECIFICALLY was weak. Not the Lannisters as a whole.
User avatar
Widowmaker94
 
Posts: 401
Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2015 18:57

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by Exakter » Wed Sep 20, 2017 08:25

ICU812 wrote:
Exakter wrote:The problem is as the last guy said... traits changed over time.

The only reason Targ traits stuck around was because they FOCUSED on inbreeding.

NONE of the other great houses did to any degree where it showed any effect. But its your submod.


The Seed is Strong....



Hair man. Hair. Hair is not "all genetic features and traits"

I mean hell, you see that between Robert and his brothers. One of whom looks like him but significantly WEAKER (renly).

Again, just me shouting out here. I think giving a coin flip to the houses for these traits will make the play through's too similar. I personally would prefer lore-style events where the player is given CHOICE. Let the player manage their dynastic STRENGTH through well-placed marriages. (Heck, I barely can stand the Targ coin flip, so I guess that gives you my perspective on this)

Either way, I wish you the best on your efforts my only other suggestion since you are heading down this path would be to give the Greyjoys negatives to intelligence. The stupid bastards.
Exakter
 
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 04:15

Re: Coin Flip for some of the Great Houses, a submod attempt

PostPosted by ICU812 » Thu Sep 21, 2017 03:15

Exakter wrote:
ICU812 wrote:
Exakter wrote:The problem is as the last guy said... traits changed over time.

The only reason Targ traits stuck around was because they FOCUSED on inbreeding.

NONE of the other great houses did to any degree where it showed any effect. But its your submod.


The Seed is Strong....



Hair man. Hair. Hair is not "all genetic features and traits"

I mean hell, you see that between Robert and his brothers. One of whom looks like him but significantly WEAKER (renly).

Again, just me shouting out here. I think giving a coin flip to the houses for these traits will make the play through's too similar. I personally would prefer lore-style events where the player is given CHOICE. Let the player manage their dynastic STRENGTH through well-placed marriages. (Heck, I barely can stand the Targ coin flip, so I guess that gives you my perspective on this)

Either way, I wish you the best on your efforts my only other suggestion since you are heading down this path would be to give the Greyjoys negatives to intelligence. The stupid bastards.


It's not just hair. It's eyes and build. Robert, Stannis and Renly are all described as tall, with blue eyes. Stannis and Robert are both broad-shouldered as well.

And as far as choice is concerned, downloading this mod is hardly forced. And no coin flip I come up with will be so powerful as to prevent crazy things from happening to certain dynasties, such as a Genius Greyjoy(I've seen it happen :D). Random chance will be a key part of it, and the majority of the time it will land on "Nothing".

I do agree that the Greyjoys will need some negative traits in their coin flip. They will defiantly get chances to be Ruthless, Greedy and Lustful. What I MIGHT do is give them a chance, should they be born Quick or Genius, to LOSE that trait. Not 100%, but maybe something like 10-30%.

I appreciate your input, even if you disagree with the idea behind this mod. Luckily, it's a free forum. Do not kneel.
ICU812
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon May 25, 2015 05:33


Return to Sub-Mods

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests