Jon and Aegon.

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Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Bardo » Sun May 05, 2013 22:46

Several theories are out there about Jon being Rhaegar and Lyanna's son, or that he was fathered by Ned and Ashara Dayne. There's also the "mummer dragon" prophecy told to Daenerys, so this is what I think is happening. Aegon is actually Rhaegar and Lyanna's son, Ned promised Lyanna to get him to safety, and probably got Varys to ship him overseas, thus, it would make him a bastard, a mummer, with no legit claim to the throne next to Dany, yet would look like Rhaegar in Connington's eyes. I think no-one saw this possibility due to the speculation that this role was actually Jon Snow's. If the true Aegon was alive, he would be older than Jon and Robb, but in the book he is described by Tyrion to be about 15, 16, meaning he is about their age, even younger, which means he was conceived at the war time. This pretty much explains why people claim they saw the real Aegon's dead body, why Varys didn't ship BOTH brothers, Rhaenys and Aegon overseas, replacing both babies, as well as what I've explained above.
Going back to Jon, if Aegon is truly the bastard son of the tower of joy, Jon would most likely be Brandon Stark's and Ashara Dayne's bastard. Ser Barristan clearly holds a grudge against the man who humiliated her, but when he speaks of Ned, he doesn't treat him as an usurper, or a dishonorable man, he even shelters him and says he was very honorable. This doesn't fit, if Ned did that to Ashara, Barristan would most likely speak wrongly about him. In the Reed flashback we are told Ned liked Ashara, but was to shy to approach her, so Brandon, who was outgoing and charismatic did. So what if Brandon fathered Jon with Ashara? Then the suicide is easily explained, Ashara was deeply in love and pregnant and she finds out that the man she loves, the father of her child, has been killed while he attempted to stop his father for burning alive, and probably his son would be killed too eventually (Like all the Darklyns were purged).
So well, I expect a lot of you to deny this hardly, can't wait for replies :P
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Snowball » Sun May 05, 2013 23:14

I really like this theory.... It makes a lot of sense to me.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by VxXxV » Mon May 06, 2013 00:58

how long Lyanna is taken captive?
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Bardo » Mon May 06, 2013 02:10

VxXxV wrote:how long Lyanna is taken captive?


I believe it wasn't specified, but she could be pregnant quite before the war, tho' if she wasn't that would also discredit the theory of Jon Snow being her son.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by LancelotLoire » Mon May 06, 2013 07:09

She disappeared shortly after the Tourney at Harrenhal IE: 281AL, Brandon Stark was onroute home when he heard news of her disappearance and rode straight to King's Landing. As he died in 282 that could mean either he got word in 282 unlikely but possible, or that he was held captive until his father managed to arrive, this is the more likely case as it would take some time for Rickard to get from the North to King's Landing and the year could have changed.

So from roughly 281-282 Lyanna disappeared, then the Battle of the Trident tool place in 283AL. That leaves at least a year after her vanishing act before she died.

I just also realized that Howland Reed was witness to the promise Eddard made Lyanna. So if R+L=J he is the only living person who would know.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by VxXxV » Mon May 06, 2013 08:17

"Aerys II was "mad", Viserys "too young", and Aegon still "a babe at the breast"

-Aegon babe at breast ,282 born
-Jon snow ,283 born
-Lyanna, 283 death

at 300 AL Tyrion found Aegon , he should be 18 years old , but Tyrion say he's 15-16
that mean he was born at 285-284 , which Lyanna already dead

Whose son is he?
Last edited by VxXxV on Mon May 06, 2013 08:44, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by LancelotLoire » Mon May 06, 2013 08:39

Aegon was born in 282AL, so he was only about a year old when he got his "head smashed". So he's nearly about the same age as Daenerys.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Bardo » Mon May 06, 2013 19:26

LancelotLoire wrote:Aegon was born in 282AL, so he was only about a year old when he got his "head smashed". So he's nearly about the same age as Daenerys.

About 2 years older, I believe, Dany was 13 at the first book, I believe, while Jon and Robb 14, which would make the true Aegon 15, he should be about 18 now. Might be he looks young and that's it, but to me, I believe it's more relevant the prophecy and Connington's loyalty to make an arguement, rather than Tyrion's opinion on the boys age.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by LancelotLoire » Mon May 06, 2013 23:42

Bardo wrote:
LancelotLoire wrote:Aegon was born in 282AL, so he was only about a year old when he got his "head smashed". So he's nearly about the same age as Daenerys.

About 2 years older, I believe, Dany was 13 at the first book, I believe, while Jon and Robb 14, which would make the true Aegon 15, he should be about 18 now. Might be he looks young and that's it, but to me, I believe it's more relevant the prophecy and Connington's loyalty to make an arguement, rather than Tyrion's opinion on the boys age.

True about Connington's loyalty. I don't think he would go with such a ruse as it would dishonor Rhaegar. As far as Tyrion's opinion... Age is a fleeting thing, I have seen 13 year olds who looked like they were in their 20s and 20 year olds who looked like they were 13 (random example)
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Bardo » Tue May 07, 2013 00:13

LancelotLoire wrote:
Bardo wrote:
LancelotLoire wrote:Aegon was born in 282AL, so he was only about a year old when he got his "head smashed". So he's nearly about the same age as Daenerys.

About 2 years older, I believe, Dany was 13 at the first book, I believe, while Jon and Robb 14, which would make the true Aegon 15, he should be about 18 now. Might be he looks young and that's it, but to me, I believe it's more relevant the prophecy and Connington's loyalty to make an arguement, rather than Tyrion's opinion on the boys age.

True about Connington's loyalty. I don't think he would go with such a ruse as it would dishonor Rhaegar. As far as Tyrion's opinion... Age is a fleeting thing, I have seen 13 year olds who looked like they were in their 20s and 20 year olds who looked like they were 13 (random example)


Besides we don't know what month he was born in and else, he might be a month from turning 17, etc.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by LancelotLoire » Tue May 07, 2013 16:27

That's definitely true. It's a touch difficult in this series to label months as they only have two seasons.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Jimolopolas » Thu May 09, 2013 12:53

If the real Aegon was around 1-2 years old when the rebellion began that would mean he was born in 280 AL. So the book begins in 298 AL and the current book is now in 300 AL making Real Aegon actually 20 not 18 or 15 or 13. This would mean that
since Daenerys was born whilst on Dragonstone in 282 - 283 AL she could not possibly be 13 at the beginning of the book which takes place in 298 AL she would be at least 17, for her to be 13 she would have to be born in 285 AL. Just my idle thoughts.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by LancelotLoire » Thu May 09, 2013 16:43

A few falts there Jimolopolas.
Robert's Rebellion started in 282 not 280 and ended in 283. So as Aegon was only a year old by the time the rebellion ended (when he was "murdered"), which happened at the very tail end of the rebellion. Remember the Lannisters did not join the rebellion until the very very end of it. He could easily have been born anywhere from the beginning of 282 to mid 282 (after the rebellion had started).

Dany wasn't born until a little later (She had been conceived just was still inside...)

The latest possible year that Dany could have been born was 284. Depending on her conception. If Aerys was killed in November but had conceived her in October, that would place her birth around July-August of 284. Time skipping ahead to the 298 of the first books start, if it started between January to July that would place her as being 13 years old for the beginning half (as she would have turned 13 in 297).
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Syn » Thu May 09, 2013 21:55

I still say Aegon is the son of Illyrio Mopatis and Serra of Lys.

From all the evidence proposed, that seems most likely to me.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Bardo » Thu May 09, 2013 22:57

Well, George said she was 13, just like he said Robb and Jon Snow were 14, he was quite specific about her and the Starks.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Jimolopolas » Sun May 12, 2013 12:33

Bardo wrote:
VxXxV wrote:how long Lyanna is taken captive?


I believe it wasn't specified, but she could be pregnant quite before the war, tho' if she wasn't that would also discredit the theory of Jon Snow being her son.


Judging from the dates i believe that she was a captive for at least 1 - 2 years, during the whole rebellion.
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by magaZIN3D » Wed May 22, 2013 01:21

I am truly sorry for all of you who hope that Jon is a Targaryan but hes Ashara Dayne and Ned Stark son .
The Lord of Light wants his enemies burnt. The Drowned God wants his enemies drowned. Why are all the gods such vicious c-nts? Where is the god of tits and wine?
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Bardo » Wed May 22, 2013 02:21

magaZIN3D wrote:I am truly sorry for all of you who hope that Jon is a Targaryan but hes Ashara Dayne and Ned Stark son .

Why not Brandon's as I said?
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by magaZIN3D » Wed May 22, 2013 02:55

as long as the baby came from Ashara limbs im ok with that , shes black haired like Jon , and Jon does have a predisposition for sword fighting and knighthood , and as Ned once said ,he consider ser Arthur Dayne the morning star as an example of the Chevalerie,
The Lord of Light wants his enemies burnt. The Drowned God wants his enemies drowned. Why are all the gods such vicious c-nts? Where is the god of tits and wine?
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Re: Jon and Aegon.

PostPosted by Syn » Wed May 22, 2013 05:30

Jon reminds me of how they described Rhaegar.

Melancholy disposition, intelligent, and all that jazz. Too many things fit for it not to be true. The evidence is overwhelming.
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